tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8727048629708500122.post392584663520550026..comments2024-02-16T16:16:41.839-08:00Comments on Nine hours of separation: In the mood for poetry: Tom Waits and Charles BukowskiSilvia Pareschihttp://www.blogger.com/profile/13167114572317069861noreply@blogger.comBlogger9125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8727048629708500122.post-12607176234883510542011-05-06T11:30:22.765-07:002011-05-06T11:30:22.765-07:00Well, maybe I was being a little provocative about...Well, maybe I was being a little provocative about Baudelaire. Just a little. But I think it might prove my point that, in many cases, sublimity can be a matter of taste. And that when you find it, you just don't care about anything else (ethics and morals included).Silvia Pareschihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13167114572317069861noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8727048629708500122.post-37725171337806432542011-05-06T05:53:27.732-07:002011-05-06T05:53:27.732-07:00She. Doesn't. Like. Baudelaire.
Give me a wee...She. Doesn't. Like. Baudelaire.<br /><br />Give me a week or two to wrap my mind around that.<br /><br />For you to convince me to appreciate Tom Waits would take more than a glass of wine; at least a magnum. By then I'd be so sloshed I'd appreciate everything and everybody.Cynthiahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00857842179930989890noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8727048629708500122.post-15327956557018402102011-05-05T11:06:52.342-07:002011-05-05T11:06:52.342-07:00Cynthia, I was thinking about your words yesterday...Cynthia, I was thinking about your words yesterday, on the bus trip that resulted in today's post (which in a roundabout way might be an answer to your comment). I disagree again with you, even though I also find myself interested in knowing if the artist was a nice person or not. And I don't like Baudelaire! :-)<br />As for Tom Waits, I'd like to try to convince you in front of a cup of coffee (or better, a glass of wine)...Silvia Pareschihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13167114572317069861noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8727048629708500122.post-6090921974782139922011-05-04T16:02:49.252-07:002011-05-04T16:02:49.252-07:00Today is the Day Of Cynthia And Silvia Not Agreein...Today is the Day Of Cynthia And Silvia Not Agreeing :-)<br />I don't think Bukowski and Waits are "completely different" as artists; I think they have a lot in common. I think they also kinda project a similar persona: world-weary and semi-nihilistic.<br />I've gotten a lot of flak from people when I tell them that what I know about an author affects my appreciation- but it's true. Someone's work has to be really sublime to overcome my negative perception of them as a human being. Baudelaire, for instance. Next time, post a poem by Baudelaire. :-DCynthiahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00857842179930989890noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8727048629708500122.post-78549934173579294362011-05-04T11:08:13.698-07:002011-05-04T11:08:13.698-07:00Ah, well, first of all we need to make a distincti...Ah, well, first of all we need to make a distinction. Bukowski and Waits are two completely different men and artists. Bukowski might have been an asshole, but this is true of many artists, and it generally doesn't affect my judgement on their work. It is a matter of taste, of course, so if you don't like it, you don't like it. As for Bukowski's lifestyle (because there's nothing wrong with Waits' current lifestyle, as far as I know), I don't think that many people nowadays would think of imitating it just because it's "romantic". It seems somehow old-fashioned to me...Silvia Pareschihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13167114572317069861noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8727048629708500122.post-47498547415107899862011-05-04T10:49:06.252-07:002011-05-04T10:49:06.252-07:00It's a complicated topic but I often think tha...It's a complicated topic but I often think that those who love people like Waits and Bukowski are somewhat complicitous in furthering a certain lifestyle.An anti-hero is one thing, but I personally think Bukowski was an asshole, and although flowers can grow from shit I don't see any flowers, literary or otherwise, springing up from this author. Including the poem you cited.Cynthiahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00857842179930989890noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8727048629708500122.post-89623264573235561452011-05-04T10:40:37.010-07:002011-05-04T10:40:37.010-07:00Cynthia, as you might imagine (since I posted this...Cynthia, as you might imagine (since I posted this), I disagree with you. Tom Waits is the closest thing to a teen idol that I still have, and as for Bukowski, well, I don't care for his stories either (actually I really dislike them), but I love his poetry. Both artists express a dark side, yes, but not necessarily only of America: I would say a dark side of the human soul (and luckily there is a dark side, or we'd all be New Agers!). Besides, I find this darkness to be very sweet and melancholic, which can be applied to a lot of poetry, American or not. And Tom Waits is a great musician as well. And... well, as you can see I get very passionate about this topic, but thanks for making me think about it! (Oh, and there would be more to say, like the part where I actually *agree* with you on the romanticizing of some - other - dark sides of America...)Silvia Pareschihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13167114572317069861noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8727048629708500122.post-23783674542820456732011-05-04T07:20:08.406-07:002011-05-04T07:20:08.406-07:00Bellissima.Bellissima.Eleonorahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10462682463517165554noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8727048629708500122.post-54621225365678610262011-05-04T05:15:30.316-07:002011-05-04T05:15:30.316-07:00Hi Silvia-
for some strange reason, foreigners se...Hi Silvia-<br /><br />for some strange reason, foreigners seem to like Tom Waits and Bukowski a lot. I have to admit that I don't care for either. Sometimes I suspect that foreigners like this sort of thing because it represents the dark side of America, which undoubtedly exists (and how). But I can tell you there aren't too many Americans living a Bukowski "lifestyle," or else we'd have the GNP of Bolivia. ;-DCynthiahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00857842179930989890noreply@blogger.com